About Us


Clifford’s interest in women began as most males does, in his early teens when nature took its course and new thoughts and urges developed. Some of us are fortunate in being born into situations where our social education is excellent either due to having enlightened parents or being brought up with the friends who have “game” and learning from them.
Clifford had to learn what he learned mostly on his own as he didn’t have a suave ladies man as a father or childhood friends who were smooth. Before the internet, he searched for books on how to have success with women in used bookstores and often in the backs of men’s magazines and has a collection of rare books that he has never seen or heard talked about in the community (did you know there was a magazine sold at newsstands called the Pick Up Times?). It was mainly trial and error that was his teacher in those days.

One day in the car, he heard on the radio of some local announcers talking about how a guy appeared on the Phil Donahue show talking about picking up women. (While not as wealthy, in his day Phil Donahue’s talk show was as big as Oprah is today.) Clifford called the station in New York and was given the Ross Jeffries’ phone number. He got Ross on the phone and ordered a copy of his book, How to Get the Women You Desire into Bed, which was by far the most advanced text he had read at that time. Clifford ended up flying to Los Angeles to meet Ross and stayed in touch with him for a couple of years. Clifford got into a relationship at one point and lost touch for awhile. When that ended, Clifford was somehow reminded about Ross but at that time much had developed. Clifford ended up traveling to Maui to attend Ross’s week long Speed Life Seminar which was the first of countless events he’s attended in the years that followed (including probably about 15 Speed Seduction events). Once you had purchased something from Ross, you were given access to his private email list service for the discussion of Speed Seduction. At one point, Clifford posted some of his own general ideas about the women on there and was told he was posting material that wasn’t acceptable because seduction in general is off topic on the SS List. Speed Seduction has been described as Neuro Linguistic Programming (NLP) as applied to seduction, and it has its own characteristics when compared to more conventional advice. As a result, Clifford put together an email and sent it around to a number of his friends and acquaintances. He thought he would put out only a few of these, but people responded to his email and sent in comments and material so he kept sending it out. And this was the birth of the Cliff’s List email newsletter .

Many important landmarks transpired over the early years and the discussion on Cliff’s List included posts by all of the early “guru’s” of the community, at a time before they became the celebrity trainers they are now. Another epic moment in the history of Cliff’s List was when Sisonpyh (a pseudonym for Eben Pagan) decided to send to Cliff’s List a long post composed of a lot of what he had learned from the community and his experiences in those early years. This post was so popular, Sisonpyh (“Hypnosis” spelled backwards) that Eben expanded it and turned it into the Double Your Dating eBook and took on the name David DeAngelo. DYD of course went on to massive success and has been an influence on countless men who have studied this material. The early years in the 2000′s as the community was starting up was a golden era, climaxed by the now legendary first Cliff’s List Convention held at the Marriott Chateau Champlain Hotel in Montreal. Guest speakers included Mystery, Style, Tyler, Dave M, Zan, Savoy, Brent, Lance Mason, Steve P., Will, Sinn, David Shade, Dr. Alex Benzer, and several others who were prominent at the time. The event was filmed by and featured a long presentation (to our knowledge, the only such presentation done by him outside of his own events and products) by Eben as David DeAngelo. A new re-mastered version of the DVD product of the first Cliff’s List Convention was released and is available here. This event was a massive success and had a very special atmosphere and vibe to it – truly a pivotal moment in the community’s history which was unique for the undertone of friendliness and mutual cooperation and respect that the attendees and speakers had for each other, something which has for the most part drifted apart in subsequent years.

Another major event in the history of the community was the publishing of The Game by Neil Strauss (“Style”). Neil embellished the descriptions of the characters in the book including his writing about Clifford, but most of the PUA’s who appeared in that book have gone on to significant commercial success in putting out books and events on having success with women. Talk is that a Hollywood movie is in the works and we may be seeing PUA’s on the big screen soon.
Clifford also spent time staying at the original and also legendary Project Hollywood Mansion, where Mystery, Style, Tyler, Papa, PlayboyLA, Xaneus (AKA Todd, formerly with RSD), and others lived and worked together to create a unique experience. It was while staying there that Courtney Love, staying at the Mansion as a guest of Neil’s, “borrowed without permission” (and never returned most of what was taken) some personal effects from Clifford including books and DVDs. Needless to say, the PHM experience was a unique episode in the history of Clifford and of the community.
Clifford also put on a second Cliff’s List Convention, which featured a varied and eclectic list of speakers and presenters including Dr. Paul, Jeffy from RSD, JT Tran (Asian Playboy), Brad P, Steve P., Zan, Lance Mason and PickUp 101, Travis and team from Authentic Man Program,Carlos Xuma, Grant Adams (Adam Gilad), Rion Williams, Vin DiCarlo, Badboy, and several others for a total of about 40 speakers. It also featured the historic debut of Johnny Soporno to the community. The long awaited DVD product from this event will be released shortly. Clifford has been involved in countless related events, bootcamps, seminars and experiences with Mystery and Style, numerous current and former RSD trainers (Tyler, Papa, Todd, Alex, Julien, Jeffy, Tim, Ryan and Sam), Dr Paul, Adam Lyons, Brent, Steve Piccus, Zan, Hypnotica, Payton Kane, Badboy, Johnny Soporno, and many others.
Cliff’s List has several missions and solemn purposes – this is the collective efforts of men to help each other to become more successful with women. We present the information that is out there and give you the opportunity to get a feel and basic understanding of the different trainers, coaches and gurus offering their theories and methods to improve your results with women, dating, love and sex. We understand that there is a lot of material out there and it’s important for you to find the person or persons you resonate with, who will have the best impact on you and where you will save yourself time and energy by zeroing in on what works best for your individual personality. We do this keeping in mind how important this is in each man’s life and how we would have loved to have a resource like this when we were teenagers. We hope you will learn a lot, maybe even contribute to our growing knowledge base and community, and benefit from the experiences that are shared here.

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