Cliff’s Behind the Scenes Report on the Cliff’s List Seminar

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Clifford in Reviews

December 29, 2013

The Seminar turned out to be a huge success, well beyond my expectations. I think you will be reading a lot about it in the next little while. I also think that the DVDs will be a massive success – they will include a lot of material that was filmed behind the scenes at the hotel and at the party so everyone who was there will also want to see the DVDs.

There were a lot of last minute developments and changes to the schedule. Stephen (PlayboyLA) and Mike (Sickboy) had to cancel. Brian had to cancel. Thundercat cancelled, and TD let me know that Papa wasn’t able to make it either. , Dimitri & Vincent, & Bart Baggett had to cancel. Other no shows included Mark B., Swinggcat, David Van Arrick, & Greg from

On the other hand, DJ from showed up and spoke, & Dave M. from also spoke. Adam Gilad from showed up with his 14 year old son (who went to a party recently and made out with 9 girls in one night recently), as did Herbal and Craig (who got on stage but who didn’t want to be filmed). Juggler gave a presentation that was not filmed either (he and Craig were the only ones who did not want to be taped).

The schedule for the seminar only got finalized midday on the Thursday before. There were some glitches but in the end everything worked out. I had had an inspiration to have William (Big G from the Montreal Lair) host the event and he did a spectacular job. He added a fun, loose personality to the event in an outstanding professional manner, and, as someone from the community, he asked the right questions at the right time, kept things moving and I just can’t say enough about how fantastic he was.

One of the highlights of the weekend for me was being out on Thursday night with a number of the guys. We went out to Cafe L’Eclusiers in Old Montreal and, by observation, I was given a real education by Brent, who moved through the crowd with an incredible energy, talking to women one after the other and showing why he is one of the best.

I had a few stresses – the first of which was the badges and hand outs didn’t arrive until about 820-825 a.m. on Friday morning and a number of the badges somehow got lost on the way over. Between getting the release forms signed and printing out missing badges (as well as cutting up all of them as they were printed 4 to a sheet and they hadn’t been cut before arriving at the hotel), the seminar start got delayed 45 minutes. We managed to pick up time as Patty only used about a half hour for her presentation which was mostly on body language. She used one of her dance students (the attractive Fanny) to help her demonstrate some body language and, while what she showed was simple, down to earth, practical and usable, you needed to hose down the room to cool it off after. It sizzled.

Another potential problem was from feminists who read the articles in the press (there was an article in the Montreal Gazette that got carried on the wire across Canada, and an article in the Montreal Mirror). Already on Friday there were posters plastered all over St.Laurent Boulevard denouncing the seminar and inciting women to protest the Cliff’s List Seminar as being demeaning to women. This was pretty ignorant to start with – these posters went up without anyone having heard any part of the seminar, spoken to me, or anything. Tried, convicted and sentenced even though the accused wasn’t there. Fortunately no one showed up to protest; the posters were all anonymous, with not a person or an organization mentioned as being the place to contact and no one claiming to be behind the call to arms.

Friday night a large group of us went to the Shed for dinner and afterwards we attended the party that was put on primarily for the seminar attendees. I had been told that about 100 models were supposed to be in attendance. Those who were there probably think that a lot of them weren’t there – but I found out after that someone had forgotten to make sure these were “single” models and many came with their boyfriends. The modeling agency setLook up this term up a display at the party (there were also areas setLook up this term aside for martial arts & hip hop/breakdancing demonstrations, as well as semi-nude models in a body painting exhibit) and I understand many of the attendees had their pictures taken with the models at the kiosk that was setLook up this term up for that by the modeling agency.

Saturday night I ended up with a smaller group on St. Denis Boulevard which was closed off for a street event as part of the Just For Laughs Festival. We ended up in a neighbourhood Italian restaurant that was nothing special, and then after drifted over to St. Laurent Boulevard to join Mystery, Style, Craig, and many others in a Spanish tapas restaurant. I was pretty burned out that evening and ended up drifting over to Shed with Cesare Cardinali, had a drink but was dozing at the table so I went home right after.

During the weekend there were a few rough moments. First was making sure that all the speakers arrived in time to do their speeches. Will left around noon on Thursday from New Jersey (normally a simple flight that should take 1-1.5 hours) and only got in the afternoon on Friday as his flight kept getting cancelled and delayed. A guru master gave David Shade a hard time with some questions during his presentation which was the only rough spot I know about that happened during all the speeches of the event (other than the guru master’s girlfriend Ghita’s inappropriate questioning of Savoy of what he rated her on the scale of 1-10 – no one is going to learn more about being successful with women from that discussion and Savoy was adept and correct to basically dismiss her question and move on).

I did have some worries about the threesome panel. My intention was to have 5 or 6 people on the panel, with 9 potential participants on my list. One by one they withdrew for different reasons (although I probably should have asked Zan and/or Will who may have been willing to go on but I was having so much difficulty getting the remaining panelists lined up that I didn’t want to introduce a new variable into the equation) and it seemed that there would only be two guys at the last minute. But I put the three participants together in the hallway outside the seminar room and they spoke with each other and got to know each other better which I think made a difference on stage. There was no fighting or heavy disputes despite the fact that all three have extremely divergent approaches to the subject matter.

The speakers were truly outstanding. I had cautioned all of them that David DeAngelo’s group typically edit out a good portion of the filming that they do and, since each speaker was only up there for a maximum of an hour, that they should try and make good use of their time with tight, well prepared material so that as little as possible will be edited out. David D remarked to me that he didn’t know what I said to the speakers to get them to tighten their presentations, but it worked.

I want to again thank everyone for helping make the event something truly special.


I have been fortunate enough to have been able to present a lot of great material in the cliff’s list newsletters and now on the website that have made a significant difference in many guy’s lives.


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